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On this board, accent as diacritical above Cyrillic vowels

A discussion of the peculiarities of languages and the differences between them.

On this board, accent as diacritical above Cyrillic vowels

Postby dsteve54 » Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:25 pm

I can see occasionally, where someone has placed acute accent marks as a diacritical above Cyrillic vowels. Cyrillic is my interest on this matter.

I THOUGHT it was done by positioning the cursor after the vowel in question and then typing the "escape sequence"
"0301 Alt-x"
to insert a Unicode 0301. It works fine in MS Word 2003, but I cannot seem to get it to work here. Perhaps I am unknowingly using some kind of font support for Cyrillic in the former environment. It is simply a "term paper" style and I can just use the above sequence with no problem...in fact, on the pulldown menu for MS Word 2003 (Insert symbol | 0301 Unicode format, shows the acute accent but the table label DOES change to "Combining diacritical marks")

On THIS board if I type:
выход
and want to correctly put the floating acute accent directly above the "ы", I try to do it likewise, but it comes out as

вы0301ход

It simply does not seem to interpret an Alt-x as ending an escape. I can see when I am PREVIEWING that characters seem to be rendered with and "&", "#" construct, but I cannot seem to identify the trailing code.

Can someone help? I just want to enter Cyrillic, as I seem to be able to just fine and then place the acute accent directly over the appropriate vowel. I can see it done in places on this site. Thanks.
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Postby Slava » Fri Aug 27, 2010 5:13 pm

I'm surprised no one ever answered this one. I know we have a couple of members who have demonstrated a decent knowledge of the inner workings of word processing. Can it really be no one has a clue? I know I don't.
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Postby dsteve54 » Fri Aug 27, 2010 6:00 pm

Slava wrote:I'm surprised no one ever answered this one. I know we have a couple of members who have demonstrated a decent knowledge of the inner workings of word processing. Can it really be no one has a clue? I know I don't.


Slava wrote:I'm surprised no one ever answered this one. "


plus

Slava wrote:Can it really be no one has a clue?


Well, remember this one:
http://www.alphadictionary.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=2337

?

Actually it seems that you and Stargazer are the only ones that participate with any frequency anymore, whether through desire, or sense of duty or both. I thank you for at least trying to visit seemingly orphaned posts.

Actually I can remember participation fairly vividly....there was a period where I submitted some questions such as the one above...true, this one did not get answers, but there was lively discussion on some of the others.

Then, and I remember this, because it impressed me at the time, the morgage crisis hit and that house of cards began to tumble with the recession and all and nearly everybody that seemed to be participating just vanished into thin air.
I do not know if there is a correlation, but at least the two situations happened to be coincident.

I had submitted some questions or comments and noticed no response like "the old days", so I recall shrugging and thinking, "Well, I guess everyone is out worrying about economic survival, rather than messing with words/philology." And to be honest, it has never been the same since.

So I submit a question or comment here and there, and sure enough only you and maybe Stargazer and occasionally Dr. Beard will try to field it....and that's that. Too bad, but I DO appreciate your efforts to scrape up postings that have been orphaned even if you do not have much of substance to add. So I guess, that's that, or at least those are my observations.

As far as the actual topic in question, I still do not know how to do it. I would have thought maybe the sys admin for running the bulletin board might know, but no response there.
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Postby Stargzer » Sun Aug 29, 2010 4:06 pm

I'm not a language expert, and most definitely not a Cyrillic expert, but using Window Character Map I found four diacritics (shown combined with Cyrillic Small Letter Nje):

Combining Cyrillic Titlo (њ҃ ),
Combining Cyrillic Palatalization (њ҄ ),
Combining Cyrillic Dasia Pneumata (њ҅ ),
and Combining Cyrillic Psili Pneumata (њ҆ ).

Is this what you're looking for? With Windows, I opened up Character Map (charmap.exe), selected "Arial" in the "Font :" box, checked the "Advanced view" box, and typed "cyrillic" in the "Search for :" box. This brings up all the Cyrillic characters. Next, I double-clicked the character (Nje: њ) and then the diacritic ( ҃ ), and then clicked the Copy button and pasted it into the message. I backspaced over the diacritic and selected the next one to get all four.

I also tried it with small letter Dze: ѕ҃ . This doesn't place the diacritic over the center of the letter, but rather over the space at the end. Again, is this what you're looking for?

The Arial font does have some Cyrillic letters with built-in diacritics (Grave, Diaresis, Breve, and Double Accute) and with a descender like the French C with Cedilla, but there are no Windows Numeric Keypad shortcuts as there are for French or Spanish (alt+0224 = à, alt+0231 = ç, alt+0241 = ñ). Note that these are Windows shortcuts using the Numeric Keypad, not Unicode sequences, although these numbers seem to be the decimal equivalent of the Unicode Hexidecimal number (0224 = 00E0, 0231 = 00E7, and 0241 = 00F1). Unicode 0400 (Ѐ) does not have a Numeric Keypad shortcut. Alt+1024 prints no character, alt+1023 prints a blank. By contrast, alt+1025 through alt+1030 print these characters respectively: ☺☻♥♦♣♠.

These numeric keypad shortcuts, by the way, date from the early days of IBM (Microsoft) DOS and BASIC. Cyrillic on a PC may have been a gleam in the eyes of IBM or Microsoft back then, but the resources weren't there back then at the genesis of the IBM Personal Computer.
Regards//Larry

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Postby bnjtokyo » Tue Aug 31, 2010 1:49 am

As you know, the Good Doctor is a Russian specialist, so you might try writing to him directly via the Contact Us page.

It's not the same format as these Agora pages, but some of the diacritics appear on the Russian Grammar pages devoted to "Movable Accents" and "Mutant Consonants" (www.alphadictionary.com/rusgrammar/accent.html.)
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Postby Stargzer » Tue Aug 31, 2010 2:41 am

A PM will reach him at Dr. Goodword.
Regards//Larry

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