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Latin's descendants

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Postby beck123 » Sun Jan 31, 2010 2:22 pm

And how about the word "bread?" One would think that the name for the first domesticated food from the vegetable kingdom would have pretty darned deep roots in the world's languages. (And has anybody determined just who is the actual king of the vegetable kingdom?) "Brot" in German - clearly related to "bread" - but words like "pan" and "pain" in the Romance languages. The two word groups don't seem related.

We need a house call from the doctor!
Last edited by beck123 on Sun Jan 31, 2010 2:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby LukeJavan8 » Sun Jan 31, 2010 2:25 pm

Celery for a salary??
I love it: use it in nearly everything I cook.
I raise parakeets (budgies) they love the leaves.
Eaty Gourmet? Very clever, there!
Mayo Clinic? You must have something clever for
the "malts" and "coffee" you will serve.
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Postby LukeJavan8 » Sun Jan 31, 2010 2:32 pm

beck123 wrote:And how about the word "bread?" One would think that the name for the first domesticated food from the vegetable kingdom would have pretty darned deep roots in the world's languages. (And has anybody determined just who is the actual king of the vegetable kingdom?) "Brot" in German - clearly related to "bread" - but words like "pan" and "pain" in the Romance languages. The two word groups don't seem related.

We need a house call from the doctor!



Yes, from someone who can trace PIE (which I am sorry
to say, I cannot, though I would love to)>
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Postby beck123 » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:33 pm

Ah, yes. PIE. Something else to offer at Eaty Gourmet's, maybe in the "Ethnic Desserts" section of the menu.
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Postby saparris » Sun Jan 31, 2010 6:44 pm

Bread comes from the protogermanic (see O.N. brauð, Dan. brød, O.Fris. brad, M.Du. brot, Du. brood, Ger. Brot).

The Spanish word pan come from the Latin panis, meaning "bread."

You can thank William the Conqueror for most of the latinate words in English--one of the reasons that English is a difficult language to learn. It's a Teutonic language with lots of Latin-based words.
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Postby LukeJavan8 » Sun Jan 31, 2010 7:50 pm

And French is pain
L'Homme ne vit pas seulement de pain.
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Postby sluggo » Sun Jan 31, 2010 9:02 pm

beck123 wrote:Salad is a modern manifestation of "salted." In modern Spanish, the word is "ensalada," which literally means "salted."

I imagine salt was the preferred salad dressing in the days when people spoke Latin.


I had no idea of this derivation. Not long ago I took a cousin to task when I witnessed her salting her salad, and we mused on whether anyone else we were related to or knew did such a thing. I won- I think she came up with her father, and that was it.

beck123 wrote:My wife and I have always (jokingly) wanted to open a restaurant called "Eaty Gourmet's"


Unfortunately, think of how many of your clientèle would just not get that :(
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Etymology Anyone?

Postby Slava » Sun Jan 31, 2010 9:28 pm

Though we're still dealing with Latin's descendants, I do believe we've perhaps gone a wee bit astray on this line. Not to be pushy, I hope, but I've started a new thread on salad in the Etymology section.

http://www.alphadictionary.com/bb/viewt ... 4085#24085
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Postby beck123 » Mon Feb 01, 2010 12:03 am

We're talking of things drawn from Latin,
And some new guys have all thrown their hat in.
It may be their fault
That the talk's turned to "salt,"
But it's just as engrossing as
"paten."

"Salad" is directly descended from Latin - in fact, in a most interesting way - so I don't see where we've gone astray.
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Postby Slava » Mon Feb 01, 2010 12:45 am

beck123 wrote:"Salad" is directly descended from Latin - in fact, in a most interesting way - so I don't see where we've gone astray.
In the sense that we're discussing a particular, not the concept. The original thread would become too clogged, extensive, intimidating, and incomprehensible if we discussed every descendant word there.

Personally, I'd like to see the first one left for discussing the languages that have descended from Latin, not the individual words.
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Postby LukeJavan8 » Mon Feb 01, 2010 12:08 pm

But how has it gone astray?
All conversations meander, in real life as well as written
in threads like these. We can always bring it back.
If we don't wander around a bit, it becomes like a
horse with blinders.
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Postby beck123 » Mon Feb 01, 2010 7:24 pm

I see Slava's point, but I also see Luke's. This was originally opened as a thread by somebody who has not contributed any additional posts, and for the last week or so there have been only four or five of us posting our thoughts. In light of that, I don't see that there's a risk of the thread becoming clogged. Nevertheless, in the interest of conceptual purity Slava has opened a new thread for our salad discussion, and we may as well use it. In fact I've posted a few there already.

I move that we continue this thread by addressing the following carwichet:

There are four official languages in Switzerland. Two are the Romance languages, Italian and French. The third is German. What is the fourth, and into what language family does it fall?
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Postby LukeJavan8 » Mon Feb 01, 2010 8:00 pm

I did not know there were four.
Perhaps Romansch or one of the Latin derivatives other
than French and Italian.
Where did you hear there were four???I thought there
were only three.
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Postby LukeJavan8 » Mon Feb 01, 2010 8:03 pm

I lose track of where things are: where is the
"Salad Discussion"?
I checked Res Deversae, but either I missed it or it is
elsewhere.
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Postby saparris » Mon Feb 01, 2010 8:12 pm

Those vulgar Latins! They should have their tongues tied.
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