Objective

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Objective

Postby Dr. Goodword » Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:23 pm

• objective •


Pronunciation: ahb-jek-tiv • Hear it!

Part of Speech: Adjective, noun

Meaning: 1. Real, actual, based on observable facts, not dependent on opinion or the mind. 2. Impartial, unbiased, free of personal feelings and opinions. 3. (Grammar) Related to the object of a verb or preposition: 'the objective case'. 4. (Noun) Goal, end, purpose. 5. (Optics) The lens which reads the light from an object and converts it into an image of the object.

Notes: This word is the antonym of subjective "Partial, biased by personal opinion". The adverb is objectively and the abstract noun, objectivity. Objectivism is the quality of objectivity, or it may refer to a literary theory of the 1930s which assumed poems to be objects susceptible to structural analysis.

In Play: Pure objectivity is an elusive goal; total exclusion of subjectivity is an impossibility: "In the absence of infallibly objective observers, judging competence is inevitably a hit and miss affair." However, since we know what it is, some people come closer to it than others: "Television news is a far cry from objective observation."

Word History: Today's Good Word was borrowed from French, the feminine form of objectif, objective. French inherited the word from Late Latin objectivus, which also produced Italian obiettivo and Portuguese and Spanish objetivo. The Latin original comprises object "object" + -ivus, an adjective suffix. Object is made up of ob "in front of, against" + iacere "to throw". Latin inherited iacere from a suffixed from of PIE ye- "to throw", seen in the English borrowings jet, jetsam, jut and all the Latinate borrowings on -ject like eject, and -jac, like subjacent. The Romance languages seem to be the only modern languages to have preserved this PIE word. We only find it otherwise in the ancient languages. (A word of thanks to Devashni Vedanta of South Africa would be the objective move at this point for his sharing today's Good Word with us.)
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Slava
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Re: Objective

Postby Slava » Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:49 am

We could go for objection, too. I have objective objections to certain things, and subjective objections, too.

Why was objectivism a literary theory about poetry in the 30s? Can't all poetry be subjected (there it is again) to structural analysis?
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Re: Objective

Postby Philip Hudson » Thu Jul 15, 2021 12:50 am

I am interested in your take on objectivism Slava. I am not sure structural analysis is about objectivism. It is too mechanical. I see it as more of a "where the rubber meets the road" attitude. Your response has piqued my interest in poetry and I have wandered all over the Internet discovering and sometimes rediscovering what poetry is to me. As for many topics, I tend to be poetically eclectic. I try to devote several hours a week to reading poetry. I do not write it myself. I never got much farther than the "a dog barked at a frog on a log in a bog" that I created all by myself in first grade. Two of my brothers write poetry.
My PhD scientist brother writes on deep subjects with little rhyme of meter. My theologian Brother writes rhyming verse on frivolous subjects. My dear wife views all poetry with disdain.
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Re: Objective

Postby David Myer » Fri Jul 16, 2021 9:26 am

Yes, poetry! I have never understood why some poetry can be incomprehensible to me and yet still widely acclaimed. I suppose I am just stupid.

A bloke I was at school with has become a notable poet in England, and I must say that on the whole I do get (most of the time) what he is getting at. You might enjoy some of his stuff. https://www.tomvaughan.website/

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Re: Objective

Postby Philip Hudson » Fri Jul 16, 2021 2:43 pm

David: I did enjoy some of your friend's poetry. I shall read more. I also like your Aussie word bloke. It is rarely used here in the hinterlands of the USA.
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Re: Objective

Postby David Myer » Fri Jul 16, 2021 7:06 pm

Yes Philip. He is a most interesting man. Among other things he is a former British Ambassador to Saudi Arabia, although with his real surname, Phillips.

Bloke is an interesting one. And for the life of me, I cannot remember whether we used it in the UK. Certainly it is ubiquitous here in Australia.

And if I am to explore the Hudson family poetry, I might start with the theologian brother. I do frivolous.

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Re: Objective

Postby David Myer » Fri Jul 16, 2021 7:13 pm

A comment on Objectivity amongst this diversion:
Pure objectivity is an elusive goal; total exclusion of subjectivity is an impossibility
I gather a great British judge said "A man cannot be unbiased unless he knows neither side of the case". This was in the days of course when man meant man or woman.

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Re: Objective

Postby David Myer » Fri Jul 16, 2021 7:19 pm

And now after a little research, I can find no author of my great quotation. Perhaps I got it wrong. But I did find this charming observation from John Stewart Mill, and I suspect others may enjoy it:

“He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them. But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion... Nor is it enough that he should hear the opinions of adversaries from his own teachers, presented as they state them, and accompanied by what they offer as refutations. He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them...he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.”

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Re: Objective

Postby tkowal » Sat Jul 17, 2021 8:51 am

Hi David,
Bloke is an interesting one. And for the life of me, I cannot remember whether we used it in the UK. Certainly it is ubiquitous here in Australia.

My son spent a few months in Australia and learnt another word that seems to mean something similar to bloke: bogan. Does it?

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Re: Objective

Postby David Myer » Sat Jul 17, 2021 9:13 am

Wow! Not really.

A bloke is any male person. A nice bloke; a good bloke, he's the sort of bloke who would always help when you are down. A term of warmth and friendliness.

A bogan often has a straggly unkempt beard and hair, drinks lots of beer and is probably socially beneath oneself. He often behaves deliberately in an ugly way in order to demonstrate a lack of care for what others think. Bogans certainly don't like pretension - but then, nor do I.

Some of them maybe good blokes.
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