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Habemus papam

A discussion of the peculiarities of languages and the differences between them.

Habemus papam

Postby Brazilian dude » Tue Apr 19, 2005 3:33 pm

Here's how the newly appointed Pope will be referred to in the selected languages playing in theaters near you:

In English: Benedict XVI.
In Portuguese: Bento XVI.
In Spanish: Benedicto XVI.
In Italian: Benedetto XVI.
In French: Benoît XVI.
In German/Czech: Benedikt XVI.
In Dutch/Swedish/Latin: Benedictus XVI.
In Romanian: Benedict al XVI-lea.
In Macedonian/Russian/Ukrainian: Бенедикт XVI.
In Polish: Benedykt XVI.
In Japanese: ベネディクト16世
In Greek: Βενέδικτος ο ΙΣΤ.

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Postby Garzo » Tue Apr 19, 2005 6:50 pm

I'm a little surprised at the curt nature of the Portuguese name. Maybe next time we'll have a Brazilian pope, and his name won't be Bento.

How about:

In Latin: Benedictus XVI

The Greeks might prefer:

In Greek: Μακάριος ο ΙϜ΄

That looks a little more patriarchal in Greek.

-- Garzo.
"Poetry is that which gets lost in translation" — Robert Frost
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Postby Brazilian dude » Tue Apr 19, 2005 7:03 pm

I'm a little surprised at the curt nature of the Portuguese name. Maybe next time we'll have a Brazilian pope, and his name won't be Bento.

To tell you the truth, me too. I was expecting Benedito, but according to the Brazilian Episcopal Congregation, there has been no tradition of popes being called Benedito [in Portuguese], that's why they opted for Bento.

Brazilian dude

P.S. The lady in the news today called him Benedito first but then got a briefing saying she should alert viewers that his name in Portuguese is properly Bento.
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Postby Brazilian dude » Tue Apr 19, 2005 7:04 pm

In Latin: Benedictus XVI

What do you mean, how about Latin? I included Latin in my list.

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Postby Brazilian dude » Tue Apr 19, 2005 11:34 pm

Come to think of it, the word benedictus in Latin is past of the verb benedire to bless, literally (to say well). Two Portuguese irregular past participles bento and bendito stammed from that Latin form, both related to the Portuguese verb bendizer. Although they have the same meaning, bendito and bento are used in different contexts. Both are used as adjectives, but bendito renders English blessed and bento renders English holy

Bendito o fruto do vosso ventre - Blessed the fruit of your womb
Água benta - holy water

The same differentiation is not made in Spanish, which uses bendito for both: bendito el fruto de vuestro vientre; agua bendita. Spanish, on the other hand, has the regular past participle bendecido, used in compound tenses, which would technically correspond to Portuguese bendizido, which doesn't exist: El sacerdote había bendecido la unión de los novios./O sacerdote havia bendito a união dos noivos. (The priest had blessed the union of the bride and groom.) Portuguese would more commonly use the verb abençoar in this case: O sacerdote havia abençoado a união dos noivos.

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Postby anders » Wed Apr 20, 2005 10:58 am

Chinese (mainland): 本笃十六世 (ben3du3 16th). 本笃 might be literally taken as "root+serious/earnest". Not bad from an atheist country!
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Postby Brazilian dude » Wed Apr 20, 2005 11:01 am

How come they use numbers inside the guy's name? Do they pronounce it à l'anglaise or à la chinoise?

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Postby Stargzer » Wed Apr 20, 2005 11:56 am

Garzo wrote: . . .The Greeks might prefer:

In Greek: Μακάριος ο ΙϜ΄

That looks a little more patriarchal in Greek.

-- Garzo.


Ahh, a translation instead of a transliteration!

ma^ka^r-ios , a, on, also os, on Pl.Lg.803c: collat. form. of makar, mostly used in Prose, but also in Poets, as Pi., and freq. in E.,

1. mostly of men, blessed, happy . . .
Regards//Larry

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Postby Brazilian dude » Wed Apr 20, 2005 12:00 pm

as Pi., and freq. in E.,

It makes a lot of sense now.

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Postby anders » Wed Apr 20, 2005 5:09 pm

Brazilian dude wrote:How come they use numbers inside the guy's name? Do they pronounce it à l'anglaise or à la chinoise?

Brazilian dude

The 世 shì means things like "age, era" and is not the normal way to express ordinals. So the name goes bendu shiliu shi.
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Postby Stargzer » Thu Apr 21, 2005 1:56 pm

Habemus locos electri papae:


Pope Benedict XVI Gets E-Mail Address

Apr 21, 9:51 AM (ET)

VATICAN CITY (AP) - Got a prayer or a problem for the new pope? Now you can e-mail him. Showing that Pope Benedict XVI intends to follow in the footsteps of John Paul II's multimedia ministry, the Vatican on Thursday modified its Web site so that users who click on an icon on the home page automatically activate an e-mail composer with his address.

In English, the address is benedictxvi@vatican.va. In Italian: benedettoxvi@vatican.va.

Vatican spokesmen could not immediately be reached for comment on how many messages Benedict may have received already.

John Paul, who died April 2, was the first pope to use e-mail, a medium that made its debut during his 26-year papacy. The Vatican said he received tens of thousands of messages in his final weeks as he struggled with illness.

In 2001, sitting in the Vatican's frescoed Clementine Hall, John Paul used a laptop to tap out an apology for Roman Catholic missionary abuses against indigenous peoples of the South Pacific.

The Vatican also used e-mail to notify journalists of John Paul's death.

The Holy See often issues news or documents to journalists via e-mail, and its labyrinth of obscure offices and councils are online in half a dozen languages. Even the Sistine Chapel, with its famed art collection, offers a virtual reality tour.
-----------------------
On the Net:

Vatican site, http://www.vatican.va


Since there are two email addresses I felt obligated to use the plural accusitive of locus.
Last edited by Stargzer on Thu Apr 21, 2005 3:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Brazilian dude » Thu Apr 21, 2005 2:25 pm

But locus is not a 4th declension noun, it's a 2nd declension noun, whose plural accusative is locos or even the irregular form [i]loca[i/].

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Postby Brazilian dude » Thu Apr 21, 2005 2:41 pm

I've heard the Portuguese term gorjeta has a similar etymology. It is thought to come from gorja, slang for throat (cf. French gorge) and has to do with the money that service providers gratuitously receive to wash their throats.

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Postby Stargzer » Thu Apr 21, 2005 3:05 pm

Brazilian dude wrote:But locus is not a 4th declension noun, it's a 2nd declension noun, whose plural accusative is locos or even the irregular form loca.

Brazilian dude


Oops.

Bless me father, for I've not thinned. It's been 39 years since my high school Latin II class. :)
Regards//Larry

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Postby tcward » Thu Apr 21, 2005 5:19 pm

I declined to take Latin.

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