I am having some trouble with the use of whom. Could anybody provide input how the following sentences score in terms of GP (grammatical correctness)?
1. Be that whom you are meant to be.
2. Your choice should be that whom you as a voter knows to be the best.
Number 2 apparently suffers from wrong agreement but otherwise sounds okay to me. Any comments?
Flam
Whom
I would shy away from the use of that as a pronoun replacement.
The less formal, but commonly accepted, rendition would be:
Be him who you're meant to be.
Your choice should be him who, as a voter, you know to be the best.
(I moved the phrase "as a voter" before the subject so the subject-verb agreement would sound ok.)
More formally, I believe I was taught that the truly correct forms should be:
Be he who you are meant to be.
Your choice should be he who, as a voter, you know to be the best.
In today's less male-gender-friendly clime, we would replace the generic he pronoun with a substitute phrase such as "the one". The who form would remain.
-Tim
The less formal, but commonly accepted, rendition would be:
Be him who you're meant to be.
Your choice should be him who, as a voter, you know to be the best.
(I moved the phrase "as a voter" before the subject so the subject-verb agreement would sound ok.)
More formally, I believe I was taught that the truly correct forms should be:
Be he who you are meant to be.
Your choice should be he who, as a voter, you know to be the best.
In today's less male-gender-friendly clime, we would replace the generic he pronoun with a substitute phrase such as "the one". The who form would remain.
-Tim
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- Grand Panjandrum
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I'm with Tim here. I think the hesitation between the nominative and the accusative (oblique) forms of the pronoun arises from the fact that in formal speech, complements of the copula «be» are in the former, unlike the objects of transitive verbs, which are in the latter. It should be remembered, however, that both in writing and in speech, the use of the accusative form of the interrogative/relative pronoun is waning - so there are not many of us left who still observe the distinction between «who», and «whom», the use of the latter being almost entirely replaced with that of the former. When it comes to the personal pronouns, however, the trend is the contrary ; with the exception of yours truly hardly any remain who still reply «It is I», to the query «Who is it ?» or «It was he» to the query «Who did it ?» (not I, of course)....
Henri
PS : Flam, if you wish to preserve the construction with «that» in the first sentence, «Be that which you are meant to be» is an option....
Henri
PS : Flam, if you wish to preserve the construction with «that» in the first sentence, «Be that which you are meant to be» is an option....
Last edited by M. Henri Day on Thu Mar 17, 2005 11:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
曾记否,到中流击水,浪遏飞舟?
Thx Tim. But how about this?
I voted for Henri whom I believed to be the best.
Here, using accusative relative pronoun is perfectly okay by me since the subordinate clause seems to be derived by wh-fronting of the following;
I believed Henri [him] to be the best.
Hope MHD would do so out there.
Flam
I voted for Henri whom I believed to be the best.
Here, using accusative relative pronoun is perfectly okay by me since the subordinate clause seems to be derived by wh-fronting of the following;
I believed Henri [him] to be the best.
Hope MHD would do so out there.
Flam
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- Grand Panjandrum
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- Grand Panjandrum
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I voted for Henri comma whom I believed to be the best.
This reminds me of the eternal linguistic arguments that Jamie and Paul Buchman have on Mad about You.
Brazilian dude, whoM is an enthusiastic user of whom. Don't let it die! Let who die? Who no whom? Who is on the first base? Who, not whom.
This reminds me of the eternal linguistic arguments that Jamie and Paul Buchman have on Mad about You.
Brazilian dude, whoM is an enthusiastic user of whom. Don't let it die! Let who die? Who no whom? Who is on the first base? Who, not whom.
Languages rule!
Especially when it should be, "Whomever is it at my door?"This topic reminds me of a joke from composition class: "Whom is it?" she asked, as she had been to night school.
gailr
she quavered.......
Katy
Last edited by KatyBr on Thu Mar 17, 2005 7:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- Great Grand Panjandrum
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Flam,
Spring Training has started, the Montreal Expos are now the Washington Nationals (at last!), and the start of Baseball season is just around the corner. So, if you want to be totally confused about Who, go listen to the classic Abbott and Costello routine "Who's On First."
There's a .wav audio clip as well as a video clip, in case you've never seen Abbott and Costello.
Spring Training has started, the Montreal Expos are now the Washington Nationals (at last!), and the start of Baseball season is just around the corner. So, if you want to be totally confused about Who, go listen to the classic Abbott and Costello routine "Who's On First."
There's a .wav audio clip as well as a video clip, in case you've never seen Abbott and Costello.
Regards//Larry
"To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them."
-- Attributed to Richard Henry Lee
"To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them."
-- Attributed to Richard Henry Lee
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